Understanding Interest Rate Policy

Last week Mike Johnson, the speaker of the House, said something stupid. OK, that has been true every week of Johnson’s tenure. But this particular remark was right up this newsletter’s alley and suggested the topic for this week’s primer.
Here’s what happened: Johnson [went on TV](https://mikejohnson.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=2651#:~:text=On%20Jerome%20Powell's%20job%20as%20Fed%20Chairman%3A&text=I%20will%20tell%20you%20that,re%20delivering%20over%20and%20over.) and supported Donald Trump’s demand that the Federal Reserve cut interest rates. Why should the Fed cut? Because, said Johnson — echoing Trump — “the American economy is hot.”
That sound you hear is thousands of economists slamming their heads on their desks. Interest rate cuts aren’t supposed to be a gold star the teacher gives you when you did well on a quiz. Interest rates are a tool for managing the economy — and a hot economy is a reason to *raise* rates, not cut them.
But I’m not sure how many people, even among those generally well-informed about public affairs, understand why economists say that. And I’m sure that relatively few people who aren’t economists know either how events and ideas led to the current consensus about interest rate policy or why there are real arguments among serious, non-MAGA people about the Fed’s next move.
So this week’s primer is about interest rate policy. Beyond the paywall I will discuss:
1\. Why the Fed matters
2\. The (controversial) tradeoff between unemployment and inflation
3\. The long search for monetary rules
4\. Post-Covid conundrums
5\. What is Trump thinking?
*The power of the Fed — and its limits*
In general, the Fed prefers to make policy based on the personal consumption expenditures price index, which differs in detail from the Consumer Price Index — don’t ask — and usually sets policy based on a “core” version of this index that excludes volatile food and energy prices. But it doesn’t matter exactly which measure you use. Inflation at the end of the 1970s was really, really high:
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Chart 1
In case you’re wondering, in today’s primer I’m going to number the charts, because I’ll want to refer back to them a couple of times.
In 1979 Jimmy Carter appointed Paul Volcker as Fed chairman, and Volcker was determined to do whatever it took to get inflation down. The Fed had not yet adopted its modern practice of setting a specific target for the federal funds rate, the interest rate at which banks lend to each other. Nonetheless, Volcker’s tight-money policies sent the fed funds rate soaring — and sent the economy into a deep recession (officially two back-to-back recessions, but most economists think of them as a single episode), with unemployment peaking in double digits:

Chart 2
Then, partway into 1982, the Fed relented. Interest rates came way down, and a few months later the economy not only emerged from recession but entered a spectacular, “Morning in America” boom.
The whole episode was a dramatic demonstration of the Fed’s power over the economy — the way its decisions on interest rates can drive recession or recovery.
Now, the Fed isn’t always that powerful. For most of the 1930s America was in a “liquidity trap,” a situation in which even a zero interest rate wasn’t low enough to restore full employment. Since it’s hard to cut rates below zero, the Fed loses most of its traction when rates hit the “zero lower bound.” The liquidity trap reemerged as an important issue in Japan during the 1990s, then in the United States and other advanced economies after the 2008 financial crisis.
Some readers may know that this is where I came in. My [1998 analysis](https://www.brookings.edu/articles/its-baaack-japans-slump-and-the-return-of-the-liquidity-trap/) of Japan’s liquidity trap and the reasons the same thing could happen to the rest of us was, I think, the single best academic paper I ever wrote.
We are, however, nowhere near a liquidity trap now. Interest rates are well above zero, and Trump wants the Fed to cut them, saying that rates should be [two to three percentage points lower](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/trump-says-us-interest-rates-054539737.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAADcf9DPOtD0Wv3TqIJ03iGMWBQHypvJl52VKT8ufgjiv2ohAsSBrY_U_xiZ_Oc7DYOJZ_n8atQj01AlmoP5GPFi_fZysTXNp_FRkgJ3YhA4P7Rh_CV6UrESR_EWMs5H3fTqnoxCkzdFmh9Bbvbgv5n4bfnk3GYXqnIZz_hLTdSVc).
But what should the Fed take into account when deciding whether to cut or raise interest rates?
*The unemployment-inflation tradeoff*
In the Volcker years the Fed demonstrated that it had the power to send unemployment soaring, then bring it back down. But why did it want high unemployment, even temporarily? To control inflation.
The belief that there is a tradeoff between unemployment and inflation is fundamental to economists’ views about Fed policy, and indeed to the Fed’s own idea of what it should be doing.
But views about the nature of that tradeoff have changed over the decades, and the *actual* nature of the tradeoff may also have changed a couple of times over the years. So let me give you an overview of the interplay between events and ideas.
It all started with a 1958 paper by the New Zealand-born economist Bill Phillips showing that there had been a long-term negative correlation between British unemployment and British wages: When unemployment was low wages rose more rapidly than when it was high. This made intuitive sense: When labor markets were tight and unemployment low, workers could demand higher wages.
American economists extrapolated Phillips’s result to suggest that there was a tradeoff between unemployment and overall inflation, which did indeed seem to fit the data for a while. In this figure the horizontal axis shows the “unemployment gap,” which I’ll explain in a minute, while the vertical axis shows the rate of core inflation. Each point represents a year between 1960 and 1968:
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Chart 3. Source: FRED
Given this apparent tradeoff, and given the clear benefits of low unemployment, there was widespread discussion about whether it would be a good idea to “move up the Phillips curve” — to accept somewhat higher inflation in return for a lower unemployment rate. However, in 1967 and 1968 Edmund S. Phelps of Columbia University and Milton Friedman independently argued that such a strategy would fail.
Any sustained rise in inflation, they argued, would end up getting built into wage- and price-setting. So, for example, historical data might suggest that you could get unemployment down from 4 percent to 3 percent by accepting 3 percent inflation rather than 1 percent. But after a while, trying to keep unemployment at 3 percent would require accepting ever-higher inflation — say, 5 percent rather than 3, then once 5 percent got built into expectations, 7 percent and so on.
The Phelps-Friedman analysis predicted that an economy whose policymakers tried to move up the Phillips curve would instead find themselves going through “clockwise spirals.” That is, rather than getting a sustained fall in unemployment, they’d find themselves with high inflation and would have to go through a period of persistent inflation despite unusually high unemployment — stagflation — to get inflation back down.
And that’s exactly what happened over the next two decades, during which the economy went through several such spirals:

Chart 4. Source: FRED
Notice that Phelps and Friedman made this prediction in the 1960s, when the United States had no previous history of stagflation. So this history reflects a triumphant success for economic analysis, although it was of course lousy for the U.S. economy.
One implication of the Phelps-Friedman analysis was that in any given year there’s some unemployment rate at which inflation will be stable, neither rising nor falling. Friedman called this the “natural rate” of unemployment. Other economists didn’t like the suggestion that there might be something good or desirable about unemployment, so many began referring to it as the NAIRU — the non-accelerating-inflation rate of unemployment. The Congressional Budget Office produces regular estimates of the NAIRU, but they call it “noncyclical unemployment.” Whatever. The unemployment gap in the charts above is the difference between actual unemployment and this CBO estimate.
One clear implication of this story — an implication that most economists and central bankers had accepted by around 1990 — was that interest rate policy had no effect on the average unemployment rate over time. Any attempt to keep unemployment persistently below the NAIRU would lead to ever-rising inflation.
Then the economy stopped following the script. After the 1980s we stopped having clockwise spirals and went back to a negative relationship between unemployment and inflation resembling what we saw in the 1960s, although possibly weaker:
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Chart 5 Source: FRED
What happened? The most popular explanation is that once inflation got low enough, expectations became “anchored,” with businesses and workers basically assuming that inflation would stay near 2 percent, and not revising that view even when inflation ran a bit hotter or colder for a while.
What does all this say about Fed policy? Low unemployment is good, and the Fed should try to achieve it. But trying to push unemployment too far down can lead to higher inflation, and runs the risk of unanchoring expectations and bringing back the stagflationary environment of the 1970s and early 1980s. So monetary policy often involves judgment calls, trading off the benefits of full employment against the risk of inflation.
Who makes that judgment? People. But people all too often engage in motivated reasoning.
Historically, nations have tried to limit the effects of motivated reasoning by putting technocrats rather than politicians in charge of central banks, and giving them considerable independence. That independence is what Trump is trying to destroy.
Even technocrats, however, make mistakes. So there’s a long history of efforts to remove the human factor entirely, to devise rules for monetary policy that don’t involve judgment calls. The Fed doesn’t follow any of these rules, but they do offer some useful guidance to the Trump-Fed dispute.
Monetary rules
Do people remember monetarism? In the 1960s and 1970s Milton Friedman aggressively pushed the idea that monetary policy could and should be put on autopilot. The Fed, he argued, should seek steady, slow growth of his preferred definition of the money supply, and if it did so the economy would take care of itself. The Fed briefly targeted the money supply rather than interest rates after 1979, which is why you see those wild interest rate fluctuations in Chart 2.
But monetarism failed. By saying this, I’m ensuring that I will receive a lot of hate mail; there are still many people who treat Friedman as an icon who must be revered, never questioned. But the fundamental premise of monetarism was that there was a stable relationship between the money supply and GDP, and that turned out not to be true.
Stanford’s John Taylor has had a more enduring influence. In 1993 he argued that the Fed should set interest rates using a formula involving only two considerations: the deviation of inflation from a target rate and how far the economy is from full employment. The inflation target, by the way, is 2 percent. How that became the magic number is a strange story — blame New Zealand! — but that would take us too far afield.
Since Taylor’s paper economists have proposed a number of variants on his original rule, but the principles are similar and the different rules generally give similar guidance.
The Fed has never formally adopted a Taylor rule. But much of the time its policy nonetheless looks as if it were following a Taylor rule. The main exceptions are when the economy faces huge disruptions, first the 2008 financial crisis and then Covid and its aftermath.
Why is this relevant? Because right now the most widely cited Taylor rules say that the current interest rate is … about right. The Atlanta Fed has a Taylor Rule Utility that calculates interest rate prescriptions for several popular versions of the Taylor rule and also lets you roll your own. Here’s what it looks like currently:

Chart 6 Source: Federal Reserve Bank of Atlanta
Now, three years ago the story was quite different. Taylor rules were calling for much higher interest rates than those the Fed was actually setting. To understand why, we need to talk about post-Covid inflation.
*Post-Covid conundrums*
Covid was a shock to the economy like no other, although there were some parallels with the dislocations after World War II, as America converted back to a peacetime economy. Employment temporarily plunged in part because of officially mandated lockdowns, in part because people voluntarily avoided activities, like in-person shopping and dentists’ appointments, that might expose them to infection. Then, as the economy recovered, inflation surged to rates not seen since the early 1980s.
Ordinarily the Fed would respond to such an inflation surge by rapidly raising interest rates, as you can see from the Taylor rules in Chart 6. In this case, however, the Fed held off and kept rates low. Why? Because Jerome Powell and his colleagues believed that the inflation surge was “transitory,” a temporary effect of post-pandemic disruptions, and would fade away of its own accord.
By late 2021 this looked like a serious misjudgment: both the level of inflation and its persistence greatly exceeded the Fed’s expectations. And so in early 2022 the Fed began increasing interest rates, going from zero to more than 5 percent.
At the time many Fed critics argued that the delay in raising rates had been a terrible mistake. Most famously, Larry Summers argued repeatedly and vehemently that getting inflation back down would require a Volcker-style disinflation, i.e. a clockwise spiral like the ones shown in Chart 4, with years of very high unemployment.
He was, fortunately, completely wrong. In fact, by 2024 events seemed to have vindicated the Fed’s initial diagnosis that the inflation surge was transitory. Inflation went much higher for longer than the Fed expected, but then it faded away even though there was no recession and unemployment remained low.
The idea that the inflation surge was about temporary supply disruptions is given further credibility by the fact that the surge was global rather than specifically American. Chart 7 shows inflation rates in the United States and the euro area:
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Chart 7
In case you’re wondering, this chart uses the Harmonized Index of Consumer Prices, a European measure also available for America, to make an apples-to-apples comparison. European inflation took off a bit later than U.S. inflation but also came down a bit later. But basically, inflation experience was the same on both sides of the Atlantic despite significant differences in monetary and fiscal policies, suggesting that global supply-chain issues were the dominant story. And those supply-chain issues have now been resolved.
This, however, creates a puzzle. The Fed raised interest rates to bring inflation down, and inflation is now down. So shouldn’t the rate hikes be reversed?
Well, that would be the natural argument if higher rates had led to a recession and high unemployment. But they haven’t! Nobody is quite sure why, but the best guess is that for a variety of reasons the interest rate consistent with full employment — “r-star” — is higher than it was a few years ago. So what does that tell us about interest rate policy?
What is Trump thinking?
Right now the state of the U.S. economy is, from the point of view of interest rate policy, more or less OK. Unemployment is a bit higher than it was at its low point last year, but remains historically low. Inflation over the past year has been somewhat above the Fed’s target, but only by around a half percentage point. So neither unemployment nor inflation data offer a compelling reason to change interest rates, and to the extent they’re giving signals, they point in opposite directions.
You could make the case for large interest rate cuts if you believed that the economy was on the edge of a major slump, perhaps caused by uncertainty over tariff policy. But while there have been warnings about the risk of a slowdown, it’s not obvious in the data, at least so far. And Trump himself keeps insisting that the economy is booming.
There is, on the other hand, very good reason to believe that inflation will rise substantially in the months ahead, as those tariffs are passed on to consumers. But this inflation bump will probably — probably — be transitory.
Is there a case for an interest rate cut? Yes, if you believe that a slump is coming and tariff hikes won’t raise long-term inflation. But it’s not an overwhelming case, and at most it’s a case for a modest cut, not what Trump is demanding — a cut of three percentage points, which is something that the Fed only does in the face of major economic crises.
So what is Trump thinking? He has argued that lower interest rates would reduce the budget deficit, by cutting the cost of servicing federal debt. But economists have a term for using monetary policy to help finance budget deficits rather than manage the economy: “fiscal dominance.” And anyone who knows economic history knows that fiscal dominance is how you get runaway inflation, Turkey or Venezuela style.
Also, as I said at the beginning, he seems to think of interest rate cuts as a sort of achievement award, something you get as a reward for running a great economy. If you say, “He can’t really believe that’s how it works,” you’re underestimating the role of sheer ignorance in human affairs. And a big interest rate cut might temporarily boost his remarkably low polling on economic policy.
The important thing for the rest of us to understand is that while there are legitimate arguments for (but also against) modest rate cuts later this year, there is no reasonable case for the mega cuts Trump is demanding.
Which does not, unfortunately, mean that he won’t eventually bully the Fed into giving him what he wants.
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