The framework for justice

When it comes answering the question of when ‘force’ can be used to establish justice, when does the government or authority have the right to inflict ‘violence’ we have to return to first principles really. We have to ask the obvious questions. Things like “What is stealing?” “How does X become your wealth?” And more importantly “When does that wealth no longer become yours?”

We can’t class taking zakaat (for example) by force as stealing, as it’s not yours to begin with. We can’t claim ‘property rights’ if it was acquired illegitimately or oppressively, like the entire story of Israel. We can’t assume that what is yours trumps every other right that belongs to others.

The problem with broad statements justified with specific circumstances, like “KYC aml is wrong and an example of governments messing up” is that it’s a very specific situation, but we’re talking generally about the state having general powers to do stuff. Meaning, even if I agree with you that KYC is lame, that doesn’t mean it justifies the entire position.

Regarding Islam and authority of violence, then that’s a sanctioned part of the judiciary. The Islamic judge can order various levels of ‘violence’ in order to implement justice. There are rules and limitations, but there is a lot of room for various levels of punishment. For example, no amount of stealing can give a judge the right to execute the thief, because the upper limit of theft was given in Islamic law, and so on.

I’m sure what we can all agree with is that arbitrary punishment not based upon what was revealed by Allaah is exactly that, arbitrary man made law. It’s inherently deficient in that without objective guidance, oppression is possible. The prophet himself didn’t want to give arbitrary rulings or punishment without revealed guidance. Hence the statement us Muslim bitcoiners always mention which is the refusal to set the prices. There was no guidance given, and he didn’t want to arbitrarily harm someone or give advantage to another. The same can be seen throughout the Sunnah, especially in the general advice to not ask too many questions, ie don’t make narrow what was wide.

But…the Sharee’ah is a dense robust system that definitely gives us enough of a foundation to be able to put up reasonable boundaries where the need arises. The same we do with our children, our employees and so on.

So to answer the specific question about where the Quraan says violence can be used for justice, then the following aayah:

لَقَدۡ أَرۡسَلۡنَا رُسُلَنَا بِٱلۡبَیِّنَـٰتِ وَأَنزَلۡنَا مَعَهُمُ ٱلۡكِتَـٰبَ وَٱلۡمِیزَانَ لِیَقُومَ ٱلنَّاسُ بِٱلۡقِسۡطِۖ وَأَنزَلۡنَا ٱلۡحَدِیدَ فِیهِ بَأۡسࣱ شَدِیدࣱ وَمَنَـٰفِعُ لِلنَّاسِ وَلِیَعۡلَمَ ٱللَّهُ مَن یَنصُرُهُۥ وَرُسُلَهُۥ بِٱلۡغَیۡبِۚ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ قَوِیٌّ عَزِیزࣱ﴿ ٢٥ ﴾

Indeed We have sent Our Messengers with clear proofs, and revealed with them the Scripture and the Balance (justice) that mankind may keep up justice. And We brought forth iron wherein is mighty power, as well as many benefits for mankind, that Allah may test who it is that will help Him (His religion), and His Messengers in the unseen. Verily, Allah is All-Strong, All-Mighty.

Al-Ḥadīd, Ayah 25

The scholars have explained that Allaah prefaces that the framework for justice has been given to us via revelation. He then says that we are supposed to use that revelation to establish justice in the lands. THEN He tells us that iron was sent down from the skies as a tool for us to establish this justice.

So we have:

1. the justice
2. the command to use that justice
3. the tool to enforce that justice

Then the aayah concludes by saying that all of this is to know who will use the above to aid the religion of Allaah and aid the messengers.

So yes, agreed that unguided man made laws are limited and often abusive, but guided laws (or at least attempted) aren’t the same. This is where libertarianism will always fail, as it is ‘unguided’. There is a ‘non-aggression’ rule, but with no actually objective guidance of what even constitutes aggression and when aggression is necessary, it will always be just a narrative, ideology, not something that can actually work in practice.